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Thread: Pardon, a grog-blog

  1. #1
    Sorcerer of the Lesser Tower
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    Pardon, a grog-blog

    Edit, removed original content: Ah, never mind, capital-L Life, she is ornery and tough enough without me adding to it. Read any day's headlines, you'll see.

    Basically all I did here was channel Pink Floyd -- hello! Anybody out there? Who can answer posed questions (yeh, some've been around a long time) about game-mechanics or the Editor? Would be cool.

    Thanx for playing. Next.
    Last edited by Lion9; 07-24-2012 at 06:06 PM.

  2. #2
    Abecedarian Mage
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    Customer frustration is always a valid detail Lion. Great games have little frustration, but even the great ones have some of it.

    Games usually only die as products if the frustration is seen to be ignored. Always express frustration if it is valid and justified. Remember, if you don't ask for something to be fixed, it won't be fixed. If the owner sees no complaints, they will presume there is nothing wrong.
    Please don't go on about how cool it is I like wargames. It gets old.
    Some of my comments are just me parroting his bitching.

  3. #3
    Sorcerer of the Lesser Tower
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    Sure, there is some frustration, Joan d'Arc. Well, more than only -- "some," I'd have to admit!

    In this case, I have decided to give the Dev -- the benefit of the doubt. Oh no no -- not that he is remotely worried about what some (doubtless -- imperium-regnum-maddened and, culturally-crazed!) American has to say.

    Could be he is overwhelmed, game-wise or personal life-wise, who knows? Perhaps he is INTENDING to play a more active role in this forum that -- he himself dreamed up and established. Some time. Later. At a time that is presently uknown. OK. That there -- when, is beyond my ken, so I leave it alone.

    Meantime, I am playing the game because there IS no other WW2 ETO GS hex-game available. But, there are three (3) in this precise genre -- that I personally know about, yep, that are in the pipe-line. And all three are -- 90+% certain... going to get -- done.

    I am guessing -- doomT simply does not realize that he could -- I say, I say, again -- could get WAY out ahead of the curve and make this game so very good that his game-making chops -- his very "reputation," would increase dramatically. Word of mouth. Works. I know this from personal experience (worked for 10+ years in the family business) and from haphazardly co-existing on several forum-boards over these last 10+ years.

    And so, I surely do remember what I had said. That I had deleted in this thread. AFTER the next patch, I'll re-visit if necessary.

    That "patch" will be a kind of watershed, or turning point, IMO. The patch needs to be explained, for one thing. IOW, it is not nearly enough to say somethin' qua-minimalist like -- "Fixed some bugs." Or, "OOBs have changed." Nope, that is -- dare I say it? Kinda -- rude.

    What? I am supposed to THEN play the game for 40 or 60 hours and notice -- myself, that... hmmm, THIS has changed, and THAT is sorta different? LOL! No, the Dev should TELL me/us so we can proceed from a solid knowledge-base and not be wondering what in dickens is new or different, see what I mean?

    So I play the game. I casually hope that my questions will be answered at some point. Since I am being Zen Hopper patient and -- just now -- giving him/them -- the benefit of the doubt. However, at some point the frustration will seize me by the (red, blue?) neck and I'll RE-state my "concerns."

    Yeh merrily, and just like "Ahhh-nold" in Terminator the Movie. <Austrian-Ami accent-> "Ahhlll be ba-aaack."

    Big freaking deal, eh? lol

  4. #4
    Suicidal Angel Administrator doomtrader's Avatar
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    Lion9,
    I do read all your posts. The thought issue with them is that everyone is too long. Also I really prefer to read them and pickup the interesting ideas and implement them, instead of discuss.

    Another thing is that many, many of your proposals and wishes has been made for Time of Fury. Strategic War in Europe was designed as much simpler and faster game, but still with the possibility to customize it to the needs of players if they wish to do so. SO this is the reason why we are not going to implement them here.

  5. #5
    Sorcerer of the Lesser Tower
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    Quote Originally Posted by doomtrader View Post
    Lion9,
    I do read all your posts. The thought issue with them is that everyone is too long.
    Yep, yer right when you are right doomT! They ARE too long. OK, henceforth I'll try -- I swear on the plaster-cast-head of -- Proust, or James Joyce -- to make them briefer.

    Also I really prefer to read them and pickup the interesting ideas and implement them, instead of discuss..
    Fair enough. I have already said that these "choices" are yours to make. Yours alone, as it should be. Has to be.

    Another thing is that many, many of your proposals and wishes has been made for Time of Fury.
    Well, you know, I'm not interested in Time of Fury. Just now. Because I MUCH prefer the 50-mile-per-hex WW2 ETO GS game. The other scale simply takes to long to complete a full game. I grew up with Third Reich and World in Flames and that is EXACTLY the scale I prefer.

    However, I really don't see why you cannot make SWiE more complex, but hey -- that's merely mini-me!

    Strategic War in Europe was designed as much simpler and faster game, but still with the possibility to customize it to the needs of players if they wish to do so. SO this is the reason why we are not going to implement them here.
    Excellent Senor! So long as we CAN customize it. And that, IMHO, requires a BETTER explanation of how everything works.

    Funny to relate, and it probably makes me look buku stupido, but... last evening I was determined to make Copenhagen similar to Gibraltar. IE, ONLY the nation that controlled Copenhagen would have access to the Baltic Sea.

    I looked at your "sea edges" file and was puzzled for awhile. Could NOT figure the thing. Because I imagined that the first two entries were [X,Y] co-ordinates. Hmmm I thought to myself -- why in dickens is [60,54] co-ordinate in there? Why, that map locale is -- not even on the map! It is somewhere due south of the Red Sea! Should I just select any random OFF-MAP co-ordinates and stick 'em in there? LOL!

    Turns out -- the first two entries were "to" and "from." From one sea-zone to another, and vice-versa. 1/2 an hour I fretted and puzzled. Then! An inspiration! I THEN opened the sea-nodes file and sure! There's the answer! 60= one sea zone, and 54= a sea zone nearby!

    OK, that was only one-half an hour of -- wasted time. IF you had included some explanation, I would have that 1/2 hour back in my body -- where it belongs!

    But, I tell you certainly -- out of 50+ hours I have spent on my MOD, I would reckon it, oh, AT LEAST 20+ hours have likewise been wasted. See what I am saying here?

    Finally, good to know that you do NOT intend to expand your game much. If at all. Fine. So long as I have the "tools" I need to make my mod how I would like it. Mostly, because NO game gives me every single little thang. Then, when done -- I'll make it available to anyone else who would like to DL it. From here, because I promise you that I'll NOT put it up on Matrix. Ever. Say la vie, that's just me!

    BTW: While I have you here, you have released an editor today. So "Wargamer" tells me. Is it the SAME as what I have now, or has it been fixed? I say *fixed* because the city-placement still doesn't work for me. Still get that FREEZE-FRAME. Ack! And no, it's quite likely not me, or my new computer that is to blame. Could be, but not likely. Etc.

  6. #6
    Sorcerer of the Lesser Tower
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    Apropos of nothing much... I once lived in Germany. 4 years. My father was Army Officer. I traveled w/family and visited every single Western Euro nation. Loved them all, and that's no lie. Not the Eastern Euro nations because of the Wall. The one Pink Floyd knocked down? Wasn't Reagan, no, not close, though ignorant folks like to say it was him.

    As our story goes, this "enlightenment" was at a very impressionable (and first-conceptualizing) time, ages -- 13 through 16, so you could say that my "Ami nature" was sorta -- Euro blooded, through and through. For instance, when I first walked into Notre Dame Cathedral (wearing my baseball cap) and turned around (cap now removed) and glanced up and saw the "Rose Window," well, I gotta tell ya, my "sensibilities" were changed, once and -- forever. Same thing @ the Louvre, when I reached to (almost) touch the "Winged Goddess."

    Later, at University, I studied all those amazing Euro philosophes -- Kirkegaard and Nietzsche and Dostoevsky were my faves -- and way back to Marcus Aurelius and Zeno and Plato too! Well, later "Uncle Sam" asked me to go overseas and so I saw quite a lot of some Asian jungle. I far preferred the Euro experience. It's OK, experience per se, arrives in any ol' shape or form, true? Anyway, just to let you know that I am respecting old, ancient cultures that have very much to -- yet teach me. Who is dumb enough to suppose their OWN culture is the ONLY one! Chauvanism, bah.

    Now. Teach us -- all! How that Editor -- works! lol
    Last edited by Lion9; 07-25-2012 at 06:28 PM.

  7. #7
    Abecedarian Mage
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    "Meantime, I am playing the game because there IS no other WW2 ETO GS hex-game available."

    I can only assume you have missed seeing Strategic Command (Battlefront) and later spin offs and Commander Europe at War (Matrix Games/Slitherine), just two quick examples. Every bit grand strategy, different in design in their own ways, similar in that WW2 in Europe can only vary so much before you don't have any connection with WW2.

    There are a lot of other games that come very close to grandy strategy, but likely are best described as theatre wide operational.
    Please don't go on about how cool it is I like wargames. It gets old.
    Some of my comments are just me parroting his bitching.

  8. #8
    Sorcerer of the Lesser Tower
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    I am looking forward to spending more time with extended family, especially grand-kids. There are travel considerations, and the usual health issues that arise when you get older. In short, I just don't have as much time for gaming as I used to. Nor, to be honest, as much "devout" interest.

    Therefore I choose games much more carefully. I am now mostly concerned to find genuine (to me) Grand Strategy games. With hexes, resembling the old games I most admired. That pretty much limits what I will buy, and play, yes? Computer WiF? Absolutely.

    Which is why I had -- and to a certain extent, still have hopes for SWiE. At least, it more closely RESEMBLES my desired proto-type, IE -- 50-mile-per-hex and it seems -- POSSIBILITIES galore.

    CEAW does not interest me. The scale is wrong. I want a game that can be finished in a reasonable amount of time. I am not "into" operational games. At all. For reasons mentioned in very first paragraph of this post.

  9. #9
    Abecedarian Mage
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    Hmm quick and dirty, you want Strategic Command the first release. It has a few gaffes, but really the thing that killed it was the absolutely worthless multiplayer file security ie cheat vulnerable. And please I certainly don't want to hear the much vaunted 'honesty of wargamers', they are all human and just as reliable as any other grouping of humans.

    But back to the game, it is indeed a game played solo hotseat as if a board game vs yourself a design you could enjoy and not be stuck playing forever. It's actually a good design. I think they ruined a good thing with the follow up creations. Why is it game designers can't just make a game, see what needs fixing and then just fix it and not pretend re inventing it all over again is a good idea. SC2 forward looks horrible. Hate the tiles.

    I've seen computer World in Flames, I wouldn't hold your breath on it being satisfactory to your stated requirements.

    Have you ever checked out Gary Grigsbys World at War A World Divided? Horrible silly graphics with a good design under the hood. If you don't mind the graphics, the game might appeal to you. It seems like an Advanced form of Axis and Allies. Detailed, but not too detailed.

    All the other designs of grand strategy I know of tend to be some form of real time concept.
    Please don't go on about how cool it is I like wargames. It gets old.
    Some of my comments are just me parroting his bitching.

  10. #10
    Sorcerer of the Lesser Tower
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    Hmm quick and dirty, you want Strategic Command the first release.
    That was a fun little game. But, no, I don't play it nowadays. One thing you can (rather, I can) say about the latest of the SC-series -- very best AI I have seen in ANY game, bar-none. Seems as though those who are lacking or lazy (Slith Inc with CEAW) coulda learnt a lesson or 2? Nah. Too much -- work.

    I've seen computer World in Flames, I wouldn't hold your breath on it being satisfactory to your stated requirements.
    So have I. Followed the development for quite some time now. Unfortunately Shannon O'Keets has had some health problems, and I wish him well. The game can wait. He's the only one who can drive it home. In one piece.

    But, I have played the board game and -- other than their TRYING to shoe-horn all those "phases" in there, computer version could well be, eventually, the gold-standard.

    Just wondering, Joan d'Arc, as we progress with this lazy dialectic -- just what ARE my -- "stated requirements?" Am awaiting with bated breath, see, thatta way I can use your Lion9-guide before I purchase my next game! JK big guy, JK!

    Have you ever checked out Gary Grigsbys World at War A World Divided? Horrible silly graphics with a good design under the hood. If you don't mind the graphics, the game might appeal to you. It seems like an Advanced form of Axis and Allies. Detailed, but not too detailed.
    I am not interested in -- shoving one big pile of units into another big, or a little or lot-lesser pile of units, on a severely circumscribed board/screen, and jumping 'round like Bojangles on the honkey-tonk table-top down 'Nawlins way, and calling that -- a war-game. So, ipso, did not buy it. Will never. Grigsby should be ashamed. Probably isn't because he raked in the bucks. For many, that's ALL that matters -- making the bucks, que no?

    Axis and Allies? Yeh, played that with my son when he was a young teenager. Was fun!

    All the other designs of grand strategy I know of tend to be some form of real time concept.
    I'll pass.

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