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Thread: The Spell System

  1. #31
    Moderator Asmodai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron View Post
    All spells are sorted into different “circles” and the circles themselves are divided into two groups. One group sorts spells according to element (or color, or whatever) the other group sorts spells according to effect.

    Elemantal Circles:
    Life
    Death
    Earth
    Fire
    Water
    Wind

    Effect Circles:
    Summoning
    Protection
    Destruction
    Mentalism
    Augmentation
    Necromancy
    Ok, I'm just going to throw this out there, as always feel free to ignore.
    I really like the idea of the Elemental Circles and the Effect Circles. I really like everything about the Elemental Circles especially the idea of "nature" magic being the union of the 4 classic elements. With the effect circles while I like the concept I wonder how you came up with those six specifically. I don't know if you've already chosen what spells you are going to implement and to which effect circle they belong but if the work hasn't already been done it seems like it would be terribly difficult to map them all so I present as an alternative the following effect circles (keeping the elemental circles as is):

    abjuration
    conjuration
    enchantment
    evocation
    illusion
    transmutation

    Rational: The D20 spells are ALL (arcane or divine) already broken down into 8 schools for you. I assume you want 6 however to match your 6 Elemental Schools. Conveniently enough two of the schools are easy to drop out. One is divination, we can drop it because it's a school even a specialist wizard can't drop (in D20). Everyone knows Divination spells and so you can ignore it as a specialization. The other school to drop is Necromancy, you can drop this because it's spells you can just map to your Elemental School of Death. That leaves you with the 6 schools you wanted, all the spells are already categorized for you, everything is good. (you may also want to take all of the Conjuration spells with the Healing subtype out of Conjuration and put them in the Elemental Life list instead).

    Again though if the work of categorizing the spells you're going to implement has already been done then this saves you nothing. I just think this is an easier way to implement the combination Elemental and Effect schools you wanted. That said, easier does not necessarily mean better and maybe this simply makes no sense at all to you. Anyway I figured I'd throw it out there for consideration, as always... feel free to ignore.

  2. #32
    Aaron does not ignore! Although he does speak of himself in third person sometimes! *plays eerie background music*

    OK, the logic behind our effects circles was simplicity. We wanted to keep it simple for the uninitiated. Take the term “abjuration”. You know what it means. People that play D20 wizards know what it means. However, people that only play D20 fighters (and everyone else in the universe) have no idea what you're talking about about, lol. When we say “destruction” spells people go “Oh, I get it! I can make destruction with magic!” I'm sure you see what I'm saying. Now, I admit mentalism and necromancy won't be clear to everyone (maybe even augmentation), but we can pick other names. I think the sorting is easier for the average person to understand. Resorting the spells into different effects circles will be very easy if we decide to make a change. So, we can wait and see what kind of feedback we get when play testing actually starts.

  3. #33
    Moderator Asmodai's Avatar
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    Rofl, you give me too much credit. I really don't get magic that well at all. If you took the D20 spell list and you stripped all the schools from them and told me to put them back in their proper schools I'd likely do a miserable job of it. While you may think that supports your claim of the uninitiated not understanding what they do the same is also true with your schools. For me at least, I would have a very difficult time figuring out which of your schools the spells go in as well... that's why I'd take the "easy" (though not necessarily better) approach and just take the D20 ones because someone else already did it. Just because I know the D20 spells are already broken into schools, doesn't mean I have a very good understanding of those schools. I'm really bad at this stuff and while others may not be quite so bad as me I think the concept of which spells go in which effect circles is going to get a bit dicey no matter which ones you use... it's just a complex topic.

  4. #34
    Suicidal Angel Administrator doomtrader's Avatar
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    Remember about those who doesn't know nothing about D20 (poor souls)

  5. #35
    Yea, lol. Like I said before, we're going to have to get a bit more feedback before we make a final decision.

  6. #36
    Moderator Asmodai's Avatar
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    I'm really cool with whatever you do. I guess from my point of view Mentalism and Augmentation are just as confusing to the uninitiated as abjuration, etc. (Maybe I'm just a bit slow though, rofl) I think there will be people that have a hard time with the effect circles no matter which way you go. You do advertise though that you are using the D20 system so some people are going to come looking for it. That doesn't mean you should be bound by it by any means though, I mean I think you are 100% correct in not trying to implement D20's version of magic in a TBS game, it's WAY too complex. But if you're going to introduce a somewhat complex system into your version (which I'd argue the Elemental + Effect circles is) then if you use something entirely made up by you then you guarantee that no one will be familiar with it out of the gate, how could they... you just developed it. If you BASE it (even if loosly) off of D20... which you already use elsewhere in the game, then at least SOME people will have some concept of what you're talking about going in, but yes, there will be those that don't either way. Again though, I have confidence that the system you end up with will work great. You guys seem to have put a lot of thought into it and as always I'm just throwing stuff at the wall to see what sticks. My ideas tend to be more on the conservative side and maybe you want to differentiate your product more than what I suggest would enable. Plus, sometimes I just have bad ideas... I know, hard to believe right?

  7. #37
    We always appreciate you throwing ideas in the hat! For one thing you never can tell what's going to make it in the game. If we get a lot more "Stick to the D20 schools! It's less confusing!" we'll try it. It's an easy thing to change

  8. #38
    Moderator Aldaron's Avatar
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    I'm having a bit of trouble with the Mentalism circle. What does it include? I'm sure most spells from enchantment, maybe also Illusion. Does it include telekinesis? Teleportation?

    And it's pretty hard to combine with others. Could you define it a bit more?

  9. #39
    It is the most confusing I readily admit, lol.

    It's all the head-games type spells. Charms, illusions, divination, etc. Everything that could be chalked up to magical mind powers. I would throw telekinesis in there, but we may get people yelling about it. We decided to put it together because we felt that in a game like WoM charms, illusions and divination were too weak by themselves.

  10. #40
    Moderator Aldaron's Avatar
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    I don't mind that you lump them togheter, it's hard to think another way to use them (sorcery was weird in MoM as well).

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